sex – Page 5 – Cubicgarden.com…

Who pays on the first date, the discussion intensified

So there’s something I’ve been keeping a little secret… I met Northern Lass 32 from the article which irked me a while ago.

When she first contacted me, I was thinking this has got to be a wind up. But she convinced me she was actually real and it was actually her. So we agreed to meet up in FYG on a early Sunday morning.

Now we agreed not to blog or write about things (a gentleman never tells) but Northern Lass and myself did get talking about who pays on the first date. Somewhat ironic being on a date. But to be honest there’s nothing new there, have had quite a few dates where we’ve talked about who pays first.

Later, in the guardian Northern Lass writes about our meeting briefly… inspired by meeting me!

The issue of who pays on a first date is a subject close to the heart of Manchester-based blogger Cubicgarden, who wrote a blog about how my first column had irked him. Which in turn irked me a bit right back. So I got in touch with him to see if we could meet up on a non-date and iron out the irks.

Cubicgarden turned out to be a brilliant chap. He’s a human dating Wikipedia, taking great interest in – and blogging about – everything from the technology to the dynamics involved in meeting someone new. His top topic being Who Pays On A First Date? We debated the topic over breakfast at FYG in the Northern Quarter last week. Personally I don’t like to be paid for on a date; it makes me feel uncomfortable, like you are not parting on an even ground.

In the guardian again but this time not for a poll, backstage related and not as a pin up, must be making progress?

If Northern Lass 32 says she feels uncomfortable, how many other woman feel the same? Here’s my little 100 person poll again.

Who pays on the first date poll

Interesting to see the comments…

MsJess
Surely you just split the bill? I would never expect someone else to pay for me for an entire evening, especially someone who is effectively a total stranger at the start of the evening. I don’t even really understand why “who pays” is a question anymore.

tombyrne1412
Why are you doing something expensive enough to be worried about who pays? Drinks is the only thing you should be doing on a first date, certainly not dinner. I find the attitude some girls have towards a guy paying a little insulting. This is not 1960 any more – I am no more going to pay for a date than you are likely to stay home all day cooking and cleaning!

JacksonPollocksNo5
You should split unless there’s an agreed second date. I hate that you’re expected to pay, it pisses me off. I avoided meals on a first date anyway, there’s no escape.

Henryplant
Flip a coin, the winner pays (not, note, the loser – get off on a better foooting).

Massive thanks to Northern Lass 32! And I can’t believe its at 670+ comments in just over 12 hours since posting…

You never get chatted up? Really? Balls…

I don’t know what I even bother linking to it (specially being from the Sun) but I thought it was worth highlighting as silly…

A WOMAN as beautiful as Purdey Miles should be fighting men off with a stick. Years ago, she would hardly have been able to enter a bar without being besieged by guys begging for a date. Yet the 23-year-old has had to turn to the internet to find romance.

She says: “No one has asked me out face-to-face for years.

“I think men have become lazy about asking women out.”

And IT worker Purdey is by no means alone. Increasingly, attractive young women like her are having to turn to the web to find love. Internet dating is one of the fastest-growing sectors in this country, generating £170million last year. Nine million people in the UK logged on for romance last year, recent figures show, and we have the highest online dating turnover in Europe. Many women feel this means men are effectively getting sex without having to put in the legwork of asking a woman out.

I’ve never heard such balls in my life…

Ok I can imagine more men are more respectful and doing less hitting on woman, heck maybe we finally got out of the clubbing woman over the head with a club and dragging them back to our caves (joke of course).

Heck I can even imagine we may have a slightly more disconnected world, once again I’m sure Sherry Turke would have a lot to say about that. But blaming the internet is a cop out. Plus don’t ruin it for every other woman who has had to deal with being hit on all the bloody time (some are thinking too)

I’ll tell you why! It takes two to tango…!

Sorry Purdey Miles, who took part in Dawn O’Porters experiment into online dating. Unless all the guys have suddenly come out of the closet or discovered there bi-sexual, it just stinks of the usual rubbish I expect to hear from the Sun. Maybe dare I say it Purdey you should have a read of SBM’s Why dont men ask women out …

Why the heck did I bother reading this garbage again?

Dawn’s guide to the odds of online dating

Well you can’t knock Channel4 for their number crunching, Matt Parker (stand up maths guy) sits with Dawn O’Porter and explains the odds of a decent match to Dawn. Something the Year of Making Love never really explored and got slated for by myself and others.

I’ve been thinking if online dating may be passing its prime as it passes into the mainstream myself. But its hard to get a grip due the lack of data out there. Dawn’s 1000 isn’t bad but you really need a much bigger sample than 1000 to really get a sense of whats happening out there.

Anyway in a previous episode Dawn had a list of do’s and don’t for online dating… I think most of them are similar or taken from Susan Quilliam (relationship psychologist) tips… Here’s the points…

1. Be ready to date. If you’re not over a previous relationship or anxious and demotivated about going online, you’ll self-sabotage. Wait until you’re emotionally available, confident in yourself, ready to put in time and energy.

Absolutely… When I first got divorced I thought I was ready to push myself out there but in actual fact I was too early. Luckily the woman I met were nice enough to point this out to me.

2. Decide what you want first. The site you use, your profile and photo all need to be chosen to suit the partner and partnership you’re looking for. So before you ever go online, think carefully through your wants, needs, deal breakers.

Yes not all sites are the same, some are known for certain types of people and so you need to think long and hard or at least try a few before going forward. Its no good trying match.com and saying well it doesn’t bloody work. I would also add don’t be put off by free online dating. In actual fact I would swear by it for many reasons including that fear to do everything in one month before the credit runs out .

3. Ignore the numbers. No site – however huge their database – will bring you results if the site users aren’t your kind of people. Plus, the ones with big memberships can overwhelm you with numbers. Instead, trawl sites to find one you personally identify with.

Indeed, Match and e-harmony are well known and over subscribed with the kind of people who (I’m assume if your reading this blog) you don’t really want to date too often. Niche dating sites like Guardian Soulmates can be pointless because everyone signs up anyway. Think uniform dating advert.

4. Don’t sell – invite. Writing your profile shouldn’t be a marketing exercise. In fact, research suggests the more you major on “I”, the more you’ll actively put people off. Instead, welcome in prospective partners by writing warmly about the relationship you’d love to have with them.

Although this might be true, I would fight back with to sell is human. You can tell a lot by what someone wants and what they are selling about themselves. Inviting is good but sometimes you need to stand out from the crowd.

5. Choose a welcoming photo not a mug shot. Get a friend or a professional photographer to take hundreds of photos of you smiling and laughing. Then choose the ones where you look the most relaxed and approachable.

Absolutely… I’ve already talked to death about pictures never to use… It still shocks me the kind of thing people put in there dating pictures… For example I was scrolling through my ok cupid locals and was blown away by a woman putting/swallowing a beer bottle. Ok its unique but boy oh boy why oh why would you ever think it was the kind of thing you should use for your dating picture? And don’t get me started on white chicks and gang signs.

6. Don’t go shopping. Studies suggest that, when faced with too much choice in partners, we make decisions on irrelevant criteria, such as whether someone wears glasses. Instead, decide who to approach based on whether their profile lets you imagine having a good relationship with them.

This is something me and imran are interested in… The digitalisation of dating/mating and whats it doing to our brains our habits and the way we see each other. I really need to sit down and read dating in the age of algorithms. I’m sure Sherry Turkle author of alone together and Barry Schwartz author of the paradox of choice would have plenty to say about this whole thing too.

7. Get real – and get real early. Don’t fall for the spell of email and text – feeling close online says nothing about whether you’re compatible in real life. So talk on the phone and meet up as soon as you possibly can.

Ah yes the whole thing about certain people are far too comfortable with chatting from a far. Sites such as Howaboutwe.com are fighting back trying to urge members outside to meet each other but generally if your person you’ve been chatting to for a long (2 months) while refuses to meetup. Think Catfish?

8. Tell the truth. Most folk on dating sites are genuinely looking for love – if they’re not, they go to ‘hook-up’ or ‘married’ sites. But many people are also insecure, so tweak age, height or weight to make a good impression. It works best to be truthful – anything else creates a false start to love.

Yes the truth is the best place to work from. Yes I know lots people lie about there height, weight, job, etc but if you have that much of a problem about it. Just don’t put it down.

9. Don’t expect instant success. In everyday life you may meet hundreds of people at work, socially or by chance before you find someone to date. The same’s true online – it can take months of regular searching before you find a match.

Yes chill out, as I said to Northern Lass 32 from the Guardian…

Chill and take your time, stop rushing and just let things wash over you as interesting experiences…

It takes time and you should enjoy the time you have while single.

10. Ignore bad behaviour. Because online dating’s so new, we haven’t worked out the courtesies: for example, many people don’t respond to approaches made to them. So if you get snubbed, rejected or dumped, ignore it; not your fault.

I agree, move on. The rules are not set and even if they are for a small community. There is floods of newbies coming into the online dating industry. Some of them don’t understand how the internet works, some don’t understand socially what works. Just brush it off and move on…

11. Get support. Find a dating buddy, someone to help you through the tricky stages, support you through disappointment, celebrate your success.

A dating buddy? Hummmm not so sure about this one. Me personally think talk about your experiences with friends and family. Yes they will laugh at first but after a while they will become supportive in some way. Also think this isn’t a zero sum game. If you make a great new friend, you win. If you meet someone you never want to see again, well you kinda of win again. Just look at it all as experiences

As usual I found a myself with a request for my video via youtube’s system, should have used the same technique as I used on this video…

Dear Mr Forrester,

Your video “dating data based on 1000 people“, may have content that is owned or licensed by Channel 4, but it’s still available on YouTube! In some cases, it may be blocked, or ads may appear next to it.

This claim is not penalizing your account status. Visit your Copyright Notice page for more details on the policy applied to your video.

Sincerely,
– The YouTube Team

Hopefully the advertising will be enough…

Dating the people on screen, but should I?

Channel4 have launched into the dating world with a number of interesting mating programmes. One of the best is Dates which I’ve blogged about before but the other biggie is there first dates show.

As part of the broadcaster’s Mating Season, Date Night will give viewers the chance to hook up with the singletons they see on screen.

Channel 4 is to enter the competitive market of online dating. Anyone who visits the broadcaster’s website will be able to apply to date pre-selected members of the public. The inevitable twist? Their first date will be filmed for an interactive documentary series, entitled Date Night.

“We’re looking for 50 or 60 people who want to come on the show,” revealed executive producer Meredith Chambers at the launch last night. “They will be known to us in advance. [Then] viewers from two weeks before the series goes out, and while the series goes out, can make a connection with those people. We want it to be as much like the real thing as possible.”

Just like any dating site, the pre-selected singletons will choose their own dates from those who get in touch online. Applicants who are overlooked first time round need not despair: they may get a second chance. “Twice or three times in each show, people whose dates didn’t work out that night will look down the barrel of the lens and say: ‘people of Britain, can you do better?’”

The first episode was last week and now the audience have the chance to join the dating pool by applying online.

I personally would consider breaking my rule about getting involved in with dating shows following the total screw up of the year of making love. But to be honest looking at the people involved I’m not so sure.

Nadia E sounds, quite nice… 31 years old, Entrepreneur wants someone whos a gentleman and someone whos a partner rather than a bit on the side. But shes from London and I don’t think that would work even with me going back and forth to London all the time.

Sophie T is maybe too young at 27 but is also from London.

There are a couple others but none really make me rush to sign up…

So the real question is should I also sign up for this one or not? I could just watch the site out of interest just in-case but it does seem better to be in the pool ahead of time? Heck who knows what might happen, might be interesting to be in the background having another first date?

I can almost feel my hand filling out the online form, although I got to say the terms and conditions are questionable…

Your profile may be removed from the First Dates website at any time for any reason at the discretion of Twenty Twenty and/or Channel 4 without notice. Twenty Twenty and Channel 4 shall also be entitled to edit your profile.

If selected…

If you appear in First Dates we may agree with you that you will become a dater on the show, in which case, members of the public will be able to apply to date you on the First Dates programme by way of the First Dates website.

If you are selected as a potential contributor and/or contributor then you consent to your personal information as it forms part of your profile being made available on the First Dates website and in connection with the rights granted by you under these terms and conditions. You understand and agree that your profile may be available publicly for an indefinite period of time.

Not a fan of some of the terms and conditions but heck what you say, its TV and its the reason why I don’t really like to be involved. But alas something is making me consider it…

Shall I or should I not?

Ok I decided to do it in the end…

My description isn’t the best but alas if you seen my OKCupid profile you will know what kind of madness I typed in (maybe I should have grammar checked it first?). If this goes badly of course I’ll be writing the whole lot on my blog, like always.

Who pays on the first date, thoughts of a bisexual lady

Ok you know I’ve covered this subject to death but found it interesting to hear the view from a bi-sexual woman on Channel4’s Bi-Curious show.

The suggestion is that woman dating woman is so much easier because they just go dutch/split the bill… Don’t know if this is true overall but I can believe it…

A review of Channel4’s Dates so far…

Channel4’s Dates is currently on its 3rd episode, next one is Tuesday? As the site says, Modern Dating. It’s complicated… Yes it darn well is… And dates starts to do it justice.

Spoilers below… you were warned!

Episode 1: David and Mia

Loved this episode, so many things about it. The way Mia waits at the bar, the way David is over dressed, the reaction of Mia at the honesty of David’s 4 kids, David’s pin point deconstruction of Mia’s in-security and finally Mia putting her foot in it with the question about her David’s ex-wife. So great and the interplay between them both is something of joy.

Have I ever been on a date with Mia? Not exactly but I have met some very confused woman who don’t know what they actually want from the date or even life. I have also met the female equivalent of David, Fresh faced new to dating. Unsurprisingly I was nothing like Mia to them.

Episode 2: Jenny and Nick

This story I was kind of enjoying but then it took a turn into something quite weird and unbelievable. I admit I have dated a couple teachers in the past and they have been quite a English rose like Jenny.

Talking of confused, lets talk about Nick. I swear the bar they are in only has men except the woman (was she a woman?), who was in the toilet. Nick also has quite a strict personality, he’s the kind of guy I can imagine some woman quite hating. When dating I tend not to, leaving anything expensive alone. Overall the episode was much more stereotypical of what a person who hasn’t been dating recently imagines its like now.

Episode 3: Mia and Stephen

Interesting story this one. Having met before and going through all that, Mia and Stephen go the street for a quick shag (once again like episode 2, I rolled my eyes a little) but it got interesting after the pub. Mia turns nurse and somewhat witnesses Mrs Black’s death. She gets a real feel of what its like to be Stephen. But Mia steals Stephen’s heart and breath at the end.

Interesting to see Stephen at the start and then at the end with a rewatch. Never had such a thing happen to me before, actually the closes story I got to that is seeing the same woman at speed dating again. Luckily things went well on the date, so we just laughed about seeing each other again for 3 mins.

Next week?

The preview looks good, some stereotypical date and a gay date. I’m interested to see if more of the characters we have met already come back, as Mia is a great character and I’m sure she’ll be back.

Channel4’s Dates, go watch it…

Angie was the first person to tell me about Channel4’s Dates…

From the creator of Skins, a witty, sexy and emotional drama series about the complicated and hilarious ways that strangers interact on dates in their quest to find love

I am happy to say I have watched the first one on my tablet half in my lunch time and the other half on the tram home.

I liked it, somethings I’ve experienced and somethings I would avoid. Interesting conclusion to the episode too. I won’t spoil it… Go watch it on 4OD now.

Why is it so hard to find a normal, single woman I fancy?

So I have been meaning to blog about Northern Lass 32 for a while, since Josh or Tim pointed me at it… She’s started writing a series for the Guardian which has got me going a few times.

Northern Lass, 32, wishes she could just do things the old-fashioned way – flutter eyelashes in a bar. Here, she opens an occasional series on navigating the new dating jungl

Ok so far so good, always good to have some more focus on dating in the 21st century, because it certainly needs it.

…as I quickly found out it’s very different in your 30s than in your 20s; things have changed. In my early 20s, I could rock up to a club and 50% of the guys would also be single. Therefore with a scientific combination of the power of averages and copious amounts of alcohol, it really wasn’t that hard to dance around someone at the Music Box (RIP), give them the eye, pretend you could hear what they were saying, then … BAM! Boyfriend! Well at least that’s how I remember it.

Now however, they are all paired off, settled down, off the shelf and there is the added minefield of multi-platform stalkfests such as Facebook and internet dating sites to navigate.

Yes those days are pretty much long gone. Many of my coupled friends say pretty much the same, go down the club and find someone ffs. Well its not that simple, specially when older and somewhat wiser?

a few of my friends had tried Internet dating and loved it. So, figuring I had nothing to lose but a subscription fee, I signed up to Guardian Soulmates and Match.com. That was 12 months ago, and wow has it been an interesting ride. The messages and dates have ranged from the lovely to the out-and-out bonkers.

I will say this now… I have tried both Match and Guardian Soulmates. Thinking was Match might have the biggest selection and Guardian Soulmates would be full of left leaning woman who might fit nicely.

Match.com for me was a total joke, I signed up for 1 month to try it out and although I did talk to a few woman nothing really got far. I did go on one or two dates but what that was about the time I really noticed how much people will lie in there profiles. Not just a bit but quite a lot… Lies about all types of things. Heck since then, I’m sniffy about all types of things.. Had a woman once lie about which country she was from, why? I have no idea!

Guardian soulmates… worst still. Why? Well its simple.

Everyone laughs at the uniform dating advert on TV. Uniform dating sign up if you wear a uniform, signup if you like people who wear them, heck sign up if you dont! Enough said really!

Well Guardian soulmates is pretty much the same. I met people who bought a guardian paper once, or those who honestly have never bought a guardian paper ever. Worst still I met a woman whose politics was right leaning. Don’t get me wrong I’m not going to reject someone just because there politics are not aligned with mine – that would be very bad. But you expect someone on Guardian Soulmates to have a slightly left leaning viewpoint on the world.

Internet dating is a bit like catalogue shopping for someone you want to hang out with. Little thumbnail pictures of, in the Guardian’s case: X hanging out with friends, or X building an African village and then X skydiving for charity. Or in Match.com’s case: X lifting up his top to show his abs and his ex-girlfriend’s name tattooed on his chest.

Among all the faces and messages, I started to communicate with a few blokes that seemed nice so started to meet up for the odd date. But a pattern emerged. All the guys I got on with and fancied didn’t come from Manchester. Derby, Sheffield, Kent, Liverpool – all great dates, all who I would see again. Manchester, on the other hand, seemed to be a hotbed of dating disaster.

If you are comparing online dating with looking in a catalogue, your maybe not taking it seriously? I do know what she means about the photos and I’ve already had my say about those. And I won’t lie a pattern is emerging for me too, mainly to do with the Cholton area of Manchester, although I wouldn’t say I have any hotbed disasters, there have been a few places I would be weary of in the future.

The further examples of dates further drive me to start “The Life and Opinions of a Datasexual Gentleman” (or some such title) – thanks Janet Davis.

Generally I’ve met woman like Northern Lass 32 (although I’ve never bumped into her directly I don’t think) and frankly they have taken everything for a joke including meeting up in real life. Usually its there first time ever meeting anyone through the internet and its all…

“a little surreal..?“

Chill and take your time, stop rushing and just let things wash over you as interesting experiences…

Heck worst comes to worst you could write a fictionalised, very contemporary, digital 21st century story connecting the rollicking & romance of 18thc classic. But of course not before I do… *smile*

updated…

I had not looked at the comments for that post till Vickytnz made a interesting comment about them. Wow, seriously wow… Maybe I should reconsider my contemporary fiction…?

The confessions/mistakes of a serial dater?

I was reading this piece in the guardian written by Twist Phelan about the amount of dates she went on.

I was a dating novice. I’d recently emerged from a 20-year marriage, and the last time I’d been single the dating landscape was totally different. I’d moved to Denver and didn’t know a soul, so my cousin Erin signed me up to a dating website to help me meet people. I’m the sort of person who does nothing by halves, so to really throw myself into the singles scene, I set myself a challenge: 100 dates in 100 days.

This is very similar to me. When I became a divorcee after 4.5 years, I also moved to another city (Manchester). The Dating landscape had moved on quite a bit and I found it difficult to grok at first but I just rolled with it (throw myself into it). However I didn’t set myself a challenge, I just saw how it went.

It became a full-time job just wading through them, sifting out the weirdos and identifying the contenders. I didn’t start dating immediately; I had a strict protocol. First we would exchange emails, then talk on the phone for a few weeks, and only after I had gauged that he sounded genuinely interesting would I arrange a date.

I was sending out a lot of replies to woman who I thought were interesting or I could see myself liking. At the start there was a lot of matches and to be fair I was lucky I discovered OkCupid and Plenty of Fish (Fun) early on so it wasn’t costing me anything to contact them. It was over time that I became much more picky (rightly or wrongly). But I can identify with the exchange emails a few times before going out. I did have quite a few woman who were interested in just meeting up (mainly on pof) but I wasn’t so keen. Funny enough the talking on the phone part never really happened, yes text but not really calling and talking.

I decided always to use the same restaurant; it seemed sensible to be somewhere familiar while meeting a stranger, so to avoid the waiters thinking I was the world’s oldest hooker, I let them know what I was doing and booked the same table each time – table 14. They were lovely, and would give me secret thumbs-up or down to signal whether they thought a date was going well.

Yes I made that same mistake too many times. When I first moved to Manchester I lived in Deansgate Locks and meet woman there too. I was far too regular in the pitcher and piano, rain bar and knott bar. Then when I moved to northern quarter, I booked far too many of my dates in at Simple. I wasn’t double or triple dating on the same day like this woman but a couple times a week and before you know it the waiters are looking at you funny.

I met some fascinating people – rocket scientists, playwrights – and went to amazing places, including Paris for lunch, with me flying the jet. I never grew bored of my endless dates – if I didn’t feel in the mood at the start of the day, I perked up by the time I was brushing my hair: this one might be “the one”.

Yes I’ve met some lovely people, some are still friends or I will never see again. Doctors, nurses, musician, bar staff, personal assistants, designers, writers, a chinese restaurant owner, illustrator, developers, a architect, etc.

I didn’t feel sad that I hadn’t found love – I’d had a brilliant time, Denver had become my home and I’d made six very close friends, including the architect who remodelled my house.

Angie asked me the other day, why don’t I go for one of those dating experts which will match me with a bunch of people they recommend. I thought about it and said pretty much the same thing. I was having a great time, gain some great friends and heck a talented architect remodelled my living room!

Ok I have threaten myself to one day write a book about my experiences because some of them are shocking but I don’t think I will because unless your dating 1 person a week or 100 dates in a 100 days, no one will care. It recently has turned into a challenge of how many or how quickly. Thats not me, I’ve become a lot more choosy and I don’t see this as a game. Maybe one day I’ll tell my story but it will be one of many as this is just the way people date in the new millennium.

Stop dating those types of woman, simple?

You may conquer with the sword, but you are conquered by a kiss

I saw this on single black male the other day, and honestly laughed to myself then tweeted it out, kind of knowing the outrage it might cause…

Let’s crunch some numbers. According to the most recent Census data, the median paycheck for Americans is $26,364, which means half of Americans made more and half made less. If most women can’t see themselves dating a man who makes $26,000 or less, then we have our answer: No, the average man cannot afford a girlfriend.

Rumor has it that these modern day women expect dates of $200, on average.
Fellas, has dating gotten too expensive? Ladies, have you found it difficult to find a man that can afford to take you on a decent date?

To be honest I’ve never really had this problem with the dates I’ve been on… except one!

Actually it reminds me of the First time I went speed dating!

She asked me where I work and I was honest and said the BBC. She then she said quote Oh I heard the BBC don’t pay a lot of money. Taken a back by this comment, I quickly replied well it depends if you let money decide what you do in life?! As you can imagine the next 2mins 40secs were pretty thorny.

Thats actually a slight lie on my part, I said something a lot more like “well it depends if your a money grabbing beoch!”

Fact is you can generalise all you like (and the SBM crew have) but it really depends on the type of woman you go out with (just like its the type of man you ladies go out with). If a woman who cared to go on dates of high amounts of money (aka a golddigger – saying it as it is sorry), went on a date with me she would be upset when its a nice place in the northern quarter. And literally be reaching deep into her bag when I don’t pay for her meal outright.

Frankly why does this even matter? Why because for some legacy reason men are expected to ask, pay and take the lead when formal dancing. Total legacy, and maybe (guessing) the same guys who couldn’t date someone taller than themselves or earns more money than themselves (not even gone there yet).

ClaireOT suggested

“You’re doing it rong, my friend. Try dating feminists!“

I don’t know if I am personally doing it wrong for myself? (sure the trolls will jump in and say how wrong I am) I would suggest most of the woman I date and go for, are feministic (if that is a word I just didn’t make up). Most if called a feminist would reject the claim only because they are modern, proud and have rejected some of the trappings of the legacy/old fashion. I’m not saying feminism is legacy or anything like that, instead I would contest most of the core values are just everyday life for most of the modern world (sure someone will tweet or comment saying I’m so wrong). For ClaireOT

I would say I am dating feminists, can’t imagine dating anything but feminists. And because of this fact, the golddigging type and myself never really cross paths. Therefore I can afford to date 🙂 However those poor (litteary) guys who go for the type who expect 200 pound dinners, its time to wake up! Grow some balls and stop being a plank.

Yes guys! its 2013! Welcome to the Future! In the future you don’t need to buy the love of a woman. If you are paying for everything on the first date and not getting interest in a second date, you are obviously not of interest to the woman in question – simple! Move on! And to point out this doesn’t make her a golddigger, it makes you a flipping pleb… Maybe the type of woman you were dating have evolved and you sadly haven’t?

The height factor?

Tall woman (photo: Marion) #floreo #panni

Josh sent me a link to this survey of people in the UK and more interestingly the height factor.

“Love the way you (don’t) lie: Manchester men among most honest online daters in UK, survey reveals”

Dating site WhatsYourPrice.com, which allows members to bid for their dates, released a survey about how often people lie on their online dating profiles. The study asked 15,200 UK members, and Manchester came out in the top five in honesty. The poll revealed that 82% of Manchester men are honest on their profiles, ranking them fourth highest in the country. Manchester women came in at sixth with 78% being honest. The study found that overall 34% of women and 21% of men lie on their online dating profiles.

Ok so nothing new there…

Embellishments included in online profiles can range from small tweaks such as adding a few inches onto height to fabrications of fictional identities. The study shows however, that women most frequently lie about their age and career, while men are most likely to lie about their height and career. Founder and CEO of WhatsYourPrice.com Brandon Wade said: “It’s interesting, though not surprising, that men are lying about their careers. “In this economy, it is very likely that a man is unsatisfied with his career, and might embellish his online dating profile as he would a resume to make himself more appealing.”

Interesting height still matters for a number of a reasons… I know men who wont date anyone taller than themselves Okcupid has something to say about this too…

REALITY: People are two inches shorter in real life.

Okcupid has tons of interesting stats to answer the question Do taller guys have more sex? The answer, to a degree, is yes, and they then expand on it… But whats even more interesting is the fact 5′ 4″ woman gets 60 more contacts each year than a six-footer.

It’s plain from these two charts that women six feet or taller are either less attractive to men or are considered too intimidating to message. The data also raises the interesting possibility that these tall women are much more likely to sleep with a man who does approach them. Compare the 6′ 0″ woman to her 5′ 4″ counterpart: the taller woman gets hit on about two-thirds as much, yet has had slightly more sex partners.

But back to the other post…

Dating expert Alex Mellor-Brook of Select Personal Introductions, Manchester, says that the survey shows how difficult the dating game has become. He said: “It’s great that the guys in Manchester are doing so well in telling the truth.

“I can understand height being a point that guy’s lie about.

“It is one of the main criteria that would be high on a woman’s wish list.

“Fashion has a lot to do with this, as shoes get higher, women do not want to be towering over their guy.

So generally, Men prefer shorter women and women prefer tall men? (not saying I do personally) Thats got to suck for the short guys, specially with the trend to towards women with bigger and taller platforms shoes… But what I’m more interested in the fact height factors really high in the list when it could be a problem.

Even when Year of making love experts (if you can call them that and thanks to Pebaline for spotting our YOML expert sticking his nose in on other stuff) were shocked by the reaction of couples who had an unbalanced in height towards the female.

Single black male have a ton of reasons and also ask the same question. The ones which is most cutting and which seems to go through most peoples minds is…

Masculinity – In her own words “Being tall gives you that athletic persona, and makes you more of a man”.

There seems to be a height factor…Superficial, stupid, old fashioned? like it or not…

10 things men and women judge each on

When Imran sent me this piece of dating data, I thought on first look… “here we go with the stereotypes…” and is sub 10,000 really enough for a decent amount of data about online dating? I guess theres so little open data, that even 5000 people from Match.com is worthy of looking at? However in some defence its always good to have biological anthropologist Helen Fisher on board somewhere.

After a little read I was surprised how interesting the results were…

Right on the most loved up day of the year… Here’s some data and feedback!

What women judge about men

Bad looking Teeth is a turn off for sure, and I don’t mean the shade. Just bad odd looking teeth. Never really thought of it as an indicator of that persons diet but for example smokers teeth is a total turn off.
I’m totally rubbish at grammar, but I decided if I can spot something wrong, then there must be something seriously wrong. This is clear to see when using certain sites.
Hair and Clothes isn’t such a bad thing, but I do look for a unique style. Of course glasses is always a plus, specially the rectangle framed ones.
Tattoo’s, I’ll be honest and say I can’t stand tattoos. Little tiny ones isn’t so bad but massive ones are just a large turn off for me. Not sure where it comes.
Nails and hands isn’t such a deal breaker, I do like soft hands.
Accents are tricky because I’ve been out with woman who I couldn’t even understand. She was lovely but I didn’t get a word she was saying.
Shoes like clothes and hair, i’m more interested in seeing a bit of unique style, something which speaks about their personality. I would never turn someone down just because they had crappy shoes.
Couldn’t give a toss what car they drive and frankly most of the woman I’ve dated carry iphones or blackberries. If I dated one which had a rooted Android phone, I honestly would be amazed

Welcome to Love in the Time of Algorithms

Imran sent me a link to this book titled Love in the time of algorithms which instantly I instantly liked…

The description is exactly what I would write if I was to publish my own thoughts instead of talking about it and doing it. Actually this post pretty much sums up what I think the book is going to cover

“If online dating can blunt the emotional pain of separation, if adults can afford to be increasingly demanding about what they want from a relationship, the effect of online dating seems positive. But what if it’s also the case that the prospect of finding an ever more compatible mate with the click of a mouse means a future of relationship instability, a paradox of choice that keeps us chasing the illusive bunny around the dating track?”

It’s the mother of all search problems: how to find a spouse, a mate, a date. The escalating marriage age and declining marriage rate mean we’re spending a greater portion of our lives unattached, searching for love well into our thirties and forties.

It’s no wonder that a third of America’s 90 million singles are turning to dating Web sites. Once considered the realm of the lonely and desperate, sites like eHarmony, Match, OkCupid, and Plenty of Fish have been embraced by pretty much every demographic. Thanks to the increasingly efficient algorithms that power these sites, dating has been transformed from a daunting transaction based on scarcity to one in which the possibilities are almost endless. Now anyone—young, old, straight, gay, and even married—can search for exactly what they want, connect with more people, and get more information about those people than ever before.

As journalist Dan Slater shows, online dating is changing society in more profound ways than we imagine. He explores how these new technologies, by altering our perception of what’s possible, are reconditioning our feelings about commitment and challenging the traditional paradigm of adult life.

Like the sexual revolution of the 1960s and ’70s, the digital revolution is forcing us to ask new questions about what constitutes “normal”: Why should we settle for someone who falls short of our expectations if there are thousands of other options just a click away? Can commitment thrive in a world of unlimited choice? Can chemistry really be quantified by math geeks? As one of Slater’s subjects wonders, “What’s the etiquette here?”

Blending history, psychology, and interviews with site creators and users, Slater takes readers behind the scenes of a fascinating business. Dating sites capitalize on our quest for love, but how do their creators’ ideas about profits, morality, and the nature of desire shape the virtual worlds they’ve created for us? Should we trust an industry whose revenue model benefits from our avoiding monogamy?

Documenting the untold story of the online-dating industry’s rise from ignominy to ubiquity—beginning with its early days as “computer dating” at Harvard in 1965—Slater offers a lively, entertaining, and thought provoking account of how we have, for better and worse, embraced technology in the most intimate aspect of our lives.

Its not available till Aug 15th but is available to pre-order if you so wish…

I’ll be keeping an eye out for this one and hopefully if Dan does a book tour or something I can rope him into doing something in Manchester which has the 2nd biggest singles population in the UK behind London. Maybe it can be a special #smc_mcr event or maybe a return to prestonsocial with something more solid?

The obvious thing would be to do a relationships 2.0?

Its not the first time I’ve seen Dan’s name come up, he wrote this critical piece about dating algorithms. Which is one of the pieces, which got me thinking about dating sites and are they actually doing what they claim to be doing? His articles reads similar to my own blog if you go by the titles alone. Just need Onlinedatingpost and Datinginsider for a full house? Anyone know how to contact any of these people?

Over drinking and dating don’t mix

Thanks Tim for sharing this on Facebook… Reminds me of this date I had one time, maybe the worst date I’ve ever had.

We met in a bar in deansgate locks (yeah classy I know but I was new to Manchester). I was 5mins late at the very most. When I spotted her, she was sitting at a table alone with 4 pint glasses in front of her. Only one was full and I thought well maybe she was with friends before. It became clear that was the wrong assumption very quickly. Me being me, I couldn’t help but ask about the pint glasses after ordering a drink. She said she was nervous and it helps calm her nerves while starting to slur her words. About 5 more minutes and it was clear she was clear starting to become very drunk.

I did something which I’m not proud of. Went into the toilet called up a friend and got him to call me soon after. Yes just like the movies… (I didn’t know what else to do, and because it was one of my earlier dates, not so long after getting divorced. I wasn’t so outspoken as I have become). The call came through and I must have won an award for that performance. However I do think she would have noticed as she was getting more hammered by the moment.

A few days later, she did text me and I did tell her, I don’t think it was going to work mainly because I’m after someone confident but I wished her luck. I did also say my friend was feeling much better after his accident and he was glad he could rely on me (therefore continuing the lie).

From my experience drinking and dating only works to a certain extent. Once you over step the mark, things can go wrong very quickly. Knowing your limits and sticking to them is essential unless you want to sleep around (and frankly a lot of people do… join pof.com) Beer googles applies to wine and cocktails as much as beer. And think about how your coming across to the other person… Who wants a leechy leery drunk as a partner?

Do Location-Based Dating Apps Really Matter?

Good question…

I wrote about OkCupid locals beta a while ago and said it was quite interesting to see the person on the phone in real life. This isn’t anything new but to see the hetrosexual world get there own thing even for a short while was interesting. Now there’s too many of them… Okcupid, Plenty of Fish, Meetmoi and even Zoosk has gotten into the field. You can now have that Bluetooting experience you’ve always wanted thanks to these apps… However are they actually used beyond having a giggle with your friends?

Another good question…

Well it seems like all this stuff, with so many different networks, the love of your life could be sitting next to you and you wouldn’t know because of the lack of interoperability between the services and their apps.

The reason why grindr did so well is because every gayman up for a bit of fun had it installed. Pushing out all the rest of the apps. If you were available and up for it, grindr was the app to have.

But back to the original question… Do they really matter?

I personally have removed Okcupid’s app from my phone because of the drain on battery and to be honest many people I know turn off the functionality. Privacy concerns and the fear of being stalked by some crazy ex may have a massive effect here? But frankly few people are openly using it and even if they are… there very unlikely to be on the same network as you.

I hate to say it but it looks like this one was the bluetoothing story all over again. Some people will have fun with the idea but for most people it will be another dream/fantasy/nightmare waiting to happen…