Tag: dating

Dirty little fingers in the data bucket

OkCupid | NO MATCH

Well I got to say… Its good to see some of the online dating sites feeling the heat from BBC’s Panorama last week.

In “Tainted Love: Secrets of the Dating Game,” the state broadcaster’s flagship current affairs program, Panorama, claimed to have uncovered a wide range of questionable practices by the online dating industry.

These include deliberate use of millions of photos and private details taken from social media sites without consent and reused to set up fake profiles of imaginary potential partners to, in the program’s words, “tempt the lovelorn.”

The documentary featured interviews with former online dating agency staffers who admitted on camera how they’d used such data to create fake profiles and adopt multiple personas to reel in those looking for love — and to boost profits.

The report also claimed the sources of this illegally obtained personal material ranged from British celebrities, politicians and even children. On camera, one former employee said that other European countries (notably Spain) were the main target, with easy pickings apparently coming from platforms such as MySpace.

As part of the investigation, reporters posing as prospective dating agency business openers were able to buy 10,000 people’s details, including birthdates and sexual preferences. That dataset included a member of the House of Lords, academics and BBC staff, all of whom told the BBC they had never signed up for such services.

Even my choice OkCupid are being targeted. Which is good because to be fair, although I do like their business model (well its better that the rest), I will never forget that they have been bought by Match.com and things are slightly changing for the worst.

 

Speed dating a cure for internet dating?

Speed Dating

My now good friend Northern Lass 32 (well she feels like one) is writing again… This time about speed dating after I advised her that speed dating with online dating keeps things interesting and quite real.

The Manchester based dating blogger Cubic Garden had mentioned to me that he had more success meeting suitable dates speed dating than he had internet dating. So we figured it was worth putting any preconceptions to one side and giving it a go.

Not quite what I said but close enough. I’ve found the dates have come from both about equal but maybe speed dating wins out by a couple.

Preconceptions out the way and they go for it… Its a weird one, I’m not sure whats worst in most peoples minds? Online dating or Speed dating? To be fair I’ve done more than enough of both to go well beyond most peoples preconceptions.

On the way to the club, Dan was also growing increasingly conscious of what to ask when it came to opening questions. It was beginning to dawn on him that this was a night of intensive small talk. “Dunno,” I helpfully advised. “Pay them a compliment, then hopefully they will start asking questions?” We hadn’t thought this through … Dan doesn’t like small talk and I’m nosey so would probably seem a bit interrogate-y. But we had arrived and there was no point backing out.

What do you talk about is the number one question most people ask me… And I refer to the Stanford research on speeddating

Two researchers at Stanford University in California were just as intrigued by speed dating as I was. They found that there are a few key factors of the standard four-minute speed date that predict whether two people are likely to hit it off. They rounded up students to take part in a series of recorded speed dating sessions, then analyzed 1,100 transcripts of the subjects’ dates.

According to the study, men and women most often said they clicked when their conversation focused mainly on the women. Women were more likely to report connecting with men who used appreciative language (like “That’s great!”). Women also reported greater levels of connection with men who interrupted them — but only when they did so to show understanding and engagement (like “Exactly”).

Counterintuitively, asking questions was not necessarily a hallmark of a good dating conversation. Asking questions actually signals a lack of connection, most likely because it indicates that the participants feel the need to put effort into keeping a boring conversation going. Signs of a good conversation are much more subtle, like the variation in speech volume.

While some previous research on speed dating has found that physical attractiveness is the most powerful force determining whether two people are initially attracted to each other, the Stanford study proves there’s more going on. Another study found that speed-dating couples with similar speaking styles were more likely to report a mutual connection.

Its the small talk between a small number of questions. Too many questions and some-things up. To be fair if you can get a load of questions in 3-4mins then your questions are pretty crap and very much yes/no questions leading no where fast.

From inside the cubicle I could hear two girls discussing Dan and how nice they thought he was. Resisting the urge to be the source of mad squealings from behind the toilet door – “Yes – date Dan … both of you … he’s ace!” – I casually walked out and then ran off to the bar to tell him. Apparently a kind of friendship paradox had just occurred, as he too had stood next to a couple of blokes who were discussing how they would like to “give me one”. Aaaaawww … this was turning out to be dead romantic!

This is the factor which is really interesting… After the main event, specially on a weekend. Its a good time to hit the city with a bunch of new friends and a love interest. If your good you might even turn some of those no’s into yes’s in your love interest’s mind. Of course its too late to change the written sheet of but its been known to maybe walk away with a number or three after a night out. For love or forever friends.

It really depends how you look at things but the night is young and opportunities are abound.

The funny thing about speed dating is its almost the total opposite of online dating. You know nothing about each other and your thrust together for a short while face to face. Can you sink or swim?  Can you hack it or will the hackles get you? Its certainly not for everyone but that’s like online dating too I guess.

It works for me, (meeting lovely women and all)  with a certain amount of caution required, as you can see in my last post

Lastly… interesting and lovely to hear Northern lass has found someone and it seems to be going well…

I looked at the details of my match on the email. I knew I wasn’t going to call him. While all this had been going on, I’d been on a couple more dates with the man I’d met on a dating site a few weeks previously.

I’d been honest with him about everything from the start, the Facebook stalking of him before we met to ensure he wasn’t a mass murderer, the writing of this column, the speed dating with someone I had met dating, and he didn’t seem fazed by any of it.

We had entered into that relationship grey area. Though there had been no discussion of us being an item, it just didn’t feel right to be contacting another person

Looks like her post months ago was maybe a little rushed/misguided (remember how it irked me and irked her) and of course adds a little more strength to my argument that Facebook is online dating’s biggest threat.

Hope it all works out Northern Lass 32! Honestly… we’ve only known each other a short while but through her writing and our brief date I feel like I know her a lot more. Good on you…!
And remember 32 isn’t far off 34 *smile* I’m still here and can always be tempted to give out more hints and tips I’ve build up in my wikipedia of dating memory *smile again*

Men get ignored all the time, what can you do?

No more date nights..

Oh you got to love Northern Lass 32, always chipping away at the sore parts of online dating but slightly missing the core…

“The Silence” – that cruel tumbleweed blowing around your inbox; when a reply to your message seems to have got lost in the ether. Because no-one is rude enough to just ignore you, right? Even more so after a few messages or even a date?

Ummmmm yes! I won’t count how many times I’ve met a woman, gone on a date and text afterwards to make sure she got home ok. And nothing…! Another text the next day and still nothing… At this point I do wonder if some serial killer is knocking my dates off around the corner from my first date venues.

And thats if you get that far…!

You got the catfish factor or as we use to call them timewasters, as all they want to do is chat online and never go dating. Those who tell ball faced lies about themselves, horrible stereotypes, bad choices with photos and out and out trolls who just want to tell you how your profile sucks… To be honest your maybe off with a empty inbox?

But I guiltily hold my hands up to also not replying from time to time. When I first started online dating I replied to every single person. Before you know it, you are juggling a fair few conversations; some that you know full well are not going to lead to a date. On asking one person I dated how they handled this situation, he simply replied: “I just ignore them.”

After experiencing being ignored a couple of times, it kind of felt that this was just the way it was done. An unwritten code of accepted rudeness that you probably wouldn’t apply in other aspects of your life – unless you were a bit of a turd.

Yes thats pretty much where I have been for a while too. Its painful and rude but its the unwritten rule. You need to remove yourself from the timewasters, lairs and trolls some how. If someone thinks your one of those, then please for the sake of your and there sanity, don’t text, email or tweet over and over again.

Leave it! Its over, get over it, get back on your horse and ride into the sunset with your head up high. You have avoided being exactly what the other person thinks you were. Even more, you avoided being a stalker! Give your self a high five…! Lastly you can relax and watch Dawn Porter‘s piece with a look at the odds of a decent match

Women on average get way more interest than than men, its the way of the world what can you do about it? Nothing so don’t get down about it, keep a positive outlook…head up high!

Is she a player or serial dater?

Phil and Tamsin‘s date on Channel4’s First dates got me going recently, specially following my blog post and discussion with Chris and others…

In Phil’s own words….

“She’s a lovely girl, she ticks a lot of boxes. But I think there’s a little bit of a player side”

Of course I have clipped the part for your own viewing pleasure… Watch it before its blocked! Too Late, so I uploaded it to Soundcloud

 

Inspiring friends and people

That's All It Takes [Day 17/365]

When I wrote the blog post about me not being a player, it was following a heated debate at a party.

Chris has been a friend for a short time and after splitting up from a long term relationship 2 years ago has been single and looking like myself.As a response to my blog post, he wrote this…

Now, one of my good friends Ian, who’s been described as a Wikipedia of dating, has helped me with this process, and although the purpose of my retrospection wasn’t really around dating (although that was a part of it – I wanted to figure out exactly what I wanted), a lot of advice around dating is actually just self-help, particularly around self-confidence. A lot of the things that are covered in dating advice books and those communities, is around an area called “inner game” – that basically boils down to self-confidence. A lot of the other bits of advice from those kind of communities are to be taken which a pinch of salt (to say the least, it can be full-on misogyny at times), but GirlOnTheNet says it better than I ever could, in that a lot of the advice from the pick up community is basically just self-confidence, and then going and talking to women).

Ian and I have different views on some aspects of dating, and although his advice has forced me to push boundaries, I’m not trying to emulate his approach exactly, as we’ve got different personalities and experiences (which is fine – there’s not one single approach to dating which works for everyone), but I have been on more dates, of which the majority have been good dates, and I’ve managed to figure out what I’m looking for as well – which is definitely something that I struggled with a year ago, and not knowing that left me paralysed at times.

He’s right, for the short while I’ve known Chris, he’s really come out of his shell and heck I’m totally touched to think I had anything to do with his genuine confidence increase.

There is also something I missed out on with my me the player post, something related to Chris’s post (didn’t even know Chris had a blog).

Most of the dates I go on, involves some kind of insightful chat (dare I say it… knowledge transfer). I bet most of the woman I date walk away with a smile on their face. I guess what I’m saying is, my intentions are noble and if I can inspire someone, increase there self confidence then great. Does this sound like a player? I certainly don’t think so…

Moi? The player? Not likely

1285bm

I gather some people easily equate serial dater with player.

From Urban dictionary – Serial Dater

One who engages in the process of systematically dating an obscene amount people in short span of time. This definition encompasses but is not limited to internet dating, bar dating, long distance flirtations, phone service dating, blind dating, expiration dating, match making, one night stands, friends with benefits, and personal ad surfing. Can be considered a politically correct alternative to word “player” both with and without a negative connotation.

From Urban dictionary – Player

A male who is skilled at manipulating (“playing”) others, and especially at seducing women by pretending to care about them, when in reality they are only interested in sex. Possibly derived from the phrases “play him for a fool”, or “play him like a violin”. The term was popularized by hip-hop culture, but was commonly recognized among urban American blacks by the 1970s.

I am simply not a player… I don’t systematically date an obscene amount of people… Ok I have dated quite a lot of woman in the last 5 years since my divorce from my wife 6 years ago. I will admit I was in a low place (I’m sure we both were) but rather than wallow in the pain, I picked myself up and went dating.

When I first started, I have to admit I may not have been ready for what was to happen. I was seeking company and it was obvious to most woman I dated. Some of the early dates were poor, but some were good and I’m still friends with a few of the women.

About this time I moved to Manchester and kept dating but this time I used going out on dates to meet new people and go to new places. Without dating, I wouldn’t have learned about a whole range of places. Yes I owe Kate a lot for showing me around but nothing like walking around with someone your romantically interested in.

I admit you could call me a serial dater in the fact I’ve dated a lot of women via internet dating and speed dating. But I reject the notion that I have systematically done this in the past, now or the future. Also it comes and goes in time. So there are months when I have one date and there are months when its sometimes 6-8. There’s also something underhanded going on when people talk about Player.

  1. I’m dating everyone with the thought of getting to know them for romantic means. Aka I won’t date for the sake of dating. There’s got to be some chemistry there. First dates are my way of understanding if I want to take it further or not. I do not pin my hopes and dreams on the first date. Which means I’m very honest when I say I have other dates lined up.
  2. I am not sleeping around. Its easy to imagine the life of a serial dater sleeping with lot of women and not giving a toss. And to be fair the media doesn’t help break this stereotype sometimes. Yes I admit I have ended up with a few women in bed but nothing like you would imagine.
  3. I am not scared of commitment. Being married for 4.5 years and a divorce tends to make you a little more cautious I will admit that much. But if someone special came around and sparks started to settle, I would of course stop dating and commit. The discussion over going exclusive is a discussion which is different in each case.

This is kind of why I want to write my own accounts and down. Put some light on what’s really going on and my own experiences, even if they are fictionalised.

I loosely call it (working title)

The life and times of a modern geeky gentleman… The confessions and mishaps of an ethical serial dater…

As I have already said to many, its certainly not 50 shades or anywhere close to the sex blogs all over the internet. No I’m imagining something like Adrian Mole’s diary but it depends on how fictional I want it to be. Right now I have written about 3 chapters, but its going to be a slow burner.

My friends from Bristol and maybe some from London would laugh at the suggestion that I’m a player. Heck my cousins would scoff at the notion. Yes I have changed a bit by being more confident and sure of myself. But I’m still the same person underneath it all and my values and thoughts for the opposite sex have not changed.

I am a single sexual liberated geek and I can see how frank and open talking style can cause people to think player. But thats their problem and not really mine. For everyone who has said something derogatory to me about my dating, I’ve had at least one person say how great it is to hear. I’ve helped quite a few women (men tend to ignore my advice) and I’m obviously doing something right…?

POF cleans up and advertises in unique locations

POF on OKC

Well I’m hearing Plenty of Fun, I mean Fish is cleaning up its hookup image…

POF is blocking hookups based on age difference and message wording, resulting in immediate bans, Intimate Encounters going away, 17% of the time we can pick the exact person you will end up dating, 70% of POF use is via a mobile phone.

Markus says, “Unfortunately about 2% of men started to use POF as more of a hookup site mostly due the the casual nature of cell phone use.”

POF have made systematic changes too… Directly from Markus the founder

1. Any first contact between users that contains sexual references will not be sent. Anyone who tries to get around this rule will be deleted without warning. This rule has actually been in effect since last month and it’s made the site so much better.

2. You can only contact people +/- 14 years of your age. There is no reason for a 50 year old man to contact a 18 year old women. The majority of messages sent outside those age ranges are all about hookups. Anyone who tries to get around this rule will get deleted.

3. Intimate Encounters will go away in the next few months. There are 3.3 Million people who use the site every day, of those there are only 6,041 single women looking for Intimate Encounters. Of those 6,041 women, the ones with hot pictures are mostly men pretending to be women. Intimate Encounters on POF can be summed up as a bunch of horny men talking to a bunch of horny men pretending to be women.

In short the vast majority of people will not be impacted. This is because the vast majority of people are not going around spamming women saying “let’s have sex tonight”. I can’t change POF alone, I need your help to get the word out there that POF is all about relationships!

So I assume with the clean up, POF needs to shout about the change… Shout about it they do, so much than you can see the advert on OKCupid.com, another free online dating site. Weird but I guess it makes sense, OKC is a dating site with a lot of daters on board.

Who pays on the first date, the discussion intensified

I Think This Date's Going Really Well

So there’s something I’ve been keeping a little secret… I met Northern Lass 32 from the article which irked me a while ago.

When she first contacted me, I was thinking this has got to be a wind up. But she convinced me she was actually real and it was actually her. So we agreed to meet up in FYG on a early Sunday morning.

Now we agreed not to blog or write about things (a gentleman never tells) but Northern Lass and myself did get talking about who pays on the first date. Somewhat ironic being on a date. But to be honest there’s nothing new there, have had quite a few dates where we’ve talked about who pays first.

Later, in the guardian Northern Lass writes about our meeting briefly… inspired by meeting me!

The issue of who pays on a first date is a subject close to the heart of Manchester-based blogger Cubicgarden, who wrote a blog about how my first column had irked him. Which in turn irked me a bit right back. So I got in touch with him to see if we could meet up on a non-date and iron out the irks.

Cubicgarden turned out to be a brilliant chap. He’s a human dating Wikipedia, taking great interest in – and blogging about – everything from the technology to the dynamics involved in meeting someone new. His top topic being Who Pays On A First Date? We debated the topic over breakfast at FYG in the Northern Quarter last week. Personally I don’t like to be paid for on a date; it makes me feel uncomfortable, like you are not parting on an even ground.

In the guardian again but this time not for a poll, backstage related and not as a pin up, must be making progress?

If Northern Lass 32 says she feels uncomfortable, how many other woman feel the same? Here’s my little 100 person poll again.

Who pays on the first date poll

Interesting to see the comments…

MsJess
Surely you just split the bill? I would never expect someone else to pay for me for an entire evening, especially someone who is effectively a total stranger at the start of the evening. I don’t even really understand why “who pays” is a question anymore.

tombyrne1412
Why are you doing something expensive enough to be worried about who pays? Drinks is the only thing you should be doing on a first date, certainly not dinner. I find the attitude some girls have towards a guy paying a little insulting. This is not 1960 any more – I am no more going to pay for a date than you are likely to stay home all day cooking and cleaning!

JacksonPollocksNo5
You should split unless there’s an agreed second date. I hate that you’re expected to pay, it pisses me off. I avoided meals on a first date anyway, there’s no escape.

Henryplant
Flip a coin, the winner pays (not, note, the loser – get off on a better foooting).

Massive thanks to Northern Lass 32! And I can’t believe its at 670+ comments in just over 12 hours since posting…

Manchester stand up and say something!

Black and White.

I know how TV works, heck I’ve had more than enough experience of how engineered certain shows can be. But Channel4’s new show right after firstdates is eye spy.

Stephen Fry narrates this new series which tests to see if the people of Great Britain really are ‘great’ and can be heroes when faced with a particularly challenging situation. Eye Spy features ingenious hidden camera stunts that throw up assorted moral dilemmas and psychological conundrums to wrestle with, challenging the notion inherent in many news stories that our ‘once great nation is going to the dogs’. You may say you’d do the right thing in a highly-pressured situation, but only when you’re actually in the moment can you ever really know.

One of the situations was a racist waiter who couldn’t deal with mixed race couples. Actually as the site says, outrageously racist waiter.

The things he said were so direct to the mixed race couple and so loud everyone could clearly hear everything being said.

And he’s the main point of concern for myself…  They ran the test in London and in Manchester. Not just Manchester but Salt & Pepper in Castlefield, a place I would go to with a date (and to be fair most of my dates are European woman)

In London, a place which is more racially diverse (as the programme points out too) the waiter got told to shut up before the couple got up and left. Actually although they ran the experiment a few times the result was the same.

However in Manchester the couple had to endure the out and out ball faced racism of the waiter. In the end they got up and left, after they were told they were upsetting the rest of the restaurant!

No one stood up and said a word, no one said anything, not a single person. They just sat there in silence eating and not saying a word. Not a single person would stand up and say your bang out of order to the waiter. Heck even getting up and walking out would have sent a clear signal that people were not happy, which is what happened when they ran the same experiment in reverse with a white couple in an Indian restaurant.

So it drives me insane to know that if I and a lady was facing such racism, no one would get involved. Not only that people would sit there in silence! Not a single word… (Shocking!) And it wasn’t like the people were old, the people seemed like students into your mid 30s type and should have known better… There is no excuse for saying nothing!

When I first looked at Manchester I did worry about being in a northern city. I seen programmes about other cities near by where separation between the races are closer to something I’ve only experienced in parts of America. Don’t get me wrong growing up in Bristol wasn’t easy. My parents amazingly moved into a area which was very white and survived through all the NF sprayed on the house, brick attacks, etc. I was also one of only 2 Black guys in my primary/junior school. I could tell stories of running away from the National Front (Kingswood was well known for being their stomping grounds) and the different brushes I’ve had with racism including in London a couple times.

What bugs me is like David Starky’s ranting is these people do/should know better. My parents and our old  lovely neighbours supported them greatly and stood up for them. Without their support things would have been a lot worst… So you can see why I’m pissed at those people and I guess the fact Manchester for not doing better.

What kind of society are we if we don’t all stand up for each other?! And yes I know the Bystander effect.

I imagine some of you are saying, stop getting so worked up… its a TV programme and one social experiment (although they did run it 3x to the same effect). Maybe I should remember the benefits of moving to Manchester but its hard to be happy and defend the great city of Manchester in the face of such a obviously bad thing, even if staged for TV…

You never get chatted up? Really? Balls…

Dr. Chatty

I don’t know what I even bother linking to it (specially being from the Sun) but I thought it was worth highlighting as silly…

A WOMAN as beautiful as Purdey Miles should be fighting men off with a stick. Years ago, she would hardly have been able to enter a bar without being besieged by guys begging for a date. Yet the 23-year-old has had to turn to the internet to find romance.

She says: “No one has asked me out face-to-face for years.

“I think men have become lazy about asking women out.”

And IT worker Purdey is by no means alone. Increasingly, attractive young women like her are having to turn to the web to find love. Internet dating is one of the fastest-growing sectors in this country, generating £170million last year. Nine million people in the UK logged on for romance last year, recent figures show, and we have the highest online dating turnover in Europe. Many women feel this means men are effectively getting sex without having to put in the legwork of asking a woman out.

I’ve never heard such balls in my life…

Ok I can imagine more men are more respectful and doing less hitting on woman, heck maybe we finally got out of the clubbing woman over the head with a club and dragging them back to our caves (joke of course).

Heck I can even imagine we may have a slightly more disconnected world, once again I’m sure Sherry Turke would have a lot to say about that. But blaming the internet is a cop out. Plus don’t ruin it for every other woman who has had to deal with being hit on all the bloody time (some are thinking too)

I’ll tell you why! It takes two to tango…!

Sorry Purdey Miles, who took part in Dawn O’Porters experiment into online dating. Unless all the guys have suddenly come out of the closet or discovered there bi-sexual, it just stinks of the usual rubbish I expect to hear from the Sun. Maybe dare I say it Purdey you should have a read of SBM’s Why dont men ask women out …

Why the heck did I bother reading this garbage again?